Well, the UK embassy may tell you that you have to, but I think they are wrong. The reason is that the UK law makes a distinction between application from within European (which requires residence), and from without. If you cannot proof residence in German, you will be treated as if you apply from without the EU. This difference is not entirely legal to start with, and even worse a lot of case workers don't understand it, and refuse applications without proof of residence. You can fight this is you want.

Or you can avoid the hassle by registering in Germany. As long as your spouse is registered, that should be as easy as getting an appointment at the local "Auslaendermeldeamt" and showing your documents. This gives you proof of residence, and then you can apply at the UK embassy without any potential problems. And don't forget to unregister when you move.

If you play this well, you will also get a "residence card" for Germany, which entitles you to enter all Schengen states for the next 5 years. Without that card, you would need a visa to travel across Europe.

 

I think this may not be completely correct. As far as I know - and this has explicitly been confirmed over the phone by UK Visas - you have to be "lawfully resident" in the EU country where you apply. Even though this sounds daunting, it in effect means that you simply have to be legally in the country - they in fact even mention visitor status as being sufficient on their website. Since you are in Germany on a tourist visa, you are "lawfully resident", and you should be issued a UK Family Permit quickly and at no charge.

I can dig out the link for you if you'd like me to.
Hope this helps.
Sebastian

 

Here's the link:
http://www.ukvisas.gov.uk/servlet/F...t/Xcelerate/ShowPage&c=Page&cid=1036679156328
The important passage:

Sebastian

 

If your husband is Dutch, Directive 2004/38 EC applies to you in Germany. This means that you cannot be refused a residence card - and your right of residence does not depend on the fulfillment of any administrative procedure (let alone a language test). If they were to insist, you can sue them - but I would be surprised if that was the case... At least that's my reading of the Directive...
Sebastian

 

Re: thanks for ur answer Thsths!!

Hi Princess

I have not been following the developments in Germany, but I had a look at the changes. I assume you referred to the changes from the 2007-08-19, made to the original law "Freizuegigkeitsgesetz/EU" from 2004-07-30. As far as I can tell, all these changes are minor, and they do not require a language test for the residence card.

You should make sure that you look into the residence card (Aufenthaltskarte-EG/Aufenthaltserlaubnis-EG), which you are entitled to due to your relation to a European citizen under Directive 2004/38. There were extensive changes made to the legislation based on Directive 2003/109/EG, which is applicable to 3rd country citizens without such a relation (Erlaubnis zum Daueraufenthalt-EG). The confusing thing is that both are based on European legislation, so the terms are very similar.

The other problem is how your case is being handled. There seem to be a lot of additional requirements, and I have read a few stories about this happening in Germany, too. You should try to clarify this with your local office, which probably requires that someone with a good understanding of German helps you.

In theory you should try to register in Holland first, but it seems that is very difficult at the moment (and you need to pass a Dutch language test!). So your other option is to apply directly for the EEA family permit at the British embassy. The later might just work, it seems to be a hit or miss thing. As long as the two of you can demonstrate sufficient income (and you do obviously speak English), it should not really be a problem.

 

Re: hmmm...

No - definitely not. That person simply hadn't realized what status you have.

Yes, but there are other administrative problems that will make your life probably a bit harder than in Germany (I'm biased - let's just say it was an "interesting" last year). I would think twice about this move unless there are job-related (or other major) reasons for doing it.
Sebastian

 

Re: hmmm...

I agree. She might not have been aware of the fact that your spouse is Dutch, or she may not have realised the legal consequences. It is not unusual that cases under the Directive 2004/38 have to be referred to a senior case worker.

Indeed. It seems that the UK has less bureaucracy, but that is only compensating justice for the fact that it is not working so well . Getting your status worked out should certainly be easier in the Germany than in the UK. So unless you have a good reason to move, I would recommend to stay in Germany.

 

Yes, I found a hint in this direction in a German forum (http://www.info4alien.de/cgi-bin/forum/ ... 1192557874, and do they refer to your case?). It is probably worth looking at some of these, to see how other people fare. Although since the immigration is organised locally, the handling may actually differ from place to place.

But the law (Freizügigkeitsgesetz/EU, especially paragraph 5a) is very clear, and pretty consistent with the European legislation. Remember: something doesn't happen just because the government says so. For it to become law, it still has to pass parliament. (Although the current coalition tends to forget that sometimes.)

No, you certainly don't have to do that. First, talk to SOLVIT (http://ec.europa.eu/solvit/site/index_en.htm), they can check your legal options and clarify at least the position of the German government. Then you can apply (make sure to get the right form, again they can differ from place to place), without including a language certificate. I would expect that to work, despite everything you may read in the media or see the government stating.

If you get a refusal, you can lodge an appeal (and you may even get a lawyer paid for that, if you are lucky). This has a delaying effect (aufschiebende Wirkung), which means you can both stay in Germany until it is heard. You may have to wait a while for the appeal, maybe up to a year. You have a good chance to win, and if not you can keep fighting. I think the case is significant enough to make it all the way to the ECJ.

BTW, your wife should be entitled to German lessons, subject to availability. If you want to stay in Germany for longer, that might be useful anyway.

 

Please keep us informed on your progress. I just can't believe the Germans are beginning to act British (or even worse in this context, Irish...). Sorry, it's late - couldn't resist. ;-)
I fully agree with thsths's view of things - and it's good you know your rights.
Good luck!
Sebastian

 

More on the language test...

I did a bit of searching and found this:

http://www.bamf.de/cln_011/SharedDo...ationFile.pdf/familiennachzug-flyer-de-en.pdf

The leaflet confirms that a language test is now necessary for spouses from abroad. However, it also says:

The leaflet is available in 19 languages on this page: http://www.bamf.de/nn_441592/DE/Ser...egration-node,gtp=443632__3D1.html?__nnn=true

Sebastian