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✎ EN Info Family Member (non-EEA) of an EEA Family Permit for UK.

Discussion in 'Immigration UK' started by gustavo.rangel, Mar 5, 2007.

  1. s_l_h_3

    s_l_h_3 Active Member

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    Hi again,

    I thought I was clear on everything, and I actually am in the important things. However, I am sort of a dilemma.

    Visa to be issued as you mentioned can take around 10 days or a bit more. Let's say two weeks. Also, I need to take the time between finishing the online application to the appointment day which will be given to her to go and submit all the papers required after finishing the online form.

    I have heard that might take several weeks up to a month, depending on how busy it gets. I cannot afford to risk to stay that long away from office. So I think what I will need to do after the weeding is to help her with the online form, provide her with all the papers needed from my side, and then I will fly back to the UK after a couple of weeks from the weeding, and then I will come back for her after she gets the visa. This way I wont be away for too long from work.

    I have a small question regarding the process. As she will be filling the online form when I am there, she will answer "No" to the question asking "Is he currently in the UK?" even though I am flying back to the UK in few days.

    My fears are that on the appointment day they will say "didnt you say he is not in the UK?, why is he not with you now?" And I am also afraid that the simple answer of "he went back for work reasons after I applied" wont satisfy them. I feel that it is something logical and could happen to anyone, but I dont know how they would see it.

    What would you recommend? An other way is for her to do everything after I fly back so the answer will be "Yes that I am in the UK currently", but that will delay our application and wont be able to start it till I fly back so she wont be with me sooner. Also, they might be sceptical about that fact that we just got married and I am already in the UK.

    I might be over thinking all this and it is just in my head! I just dont want anything to go wrong!
    Thanks in advance.
     
  2. joneeboy74

    joneeboy74 Well-Known Member

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    Ah! I see what is worrying you, but there is no need. The appointment is merely with the organisation that is under contract to act as a 'post office' to receive applications, fees, and send them on to the Embassy, and to take fingerprints, photos etc. They have absolutely nothing to do with the decision making process, and no input to it. They may have a look through what she is submitting, while she is there, just to make sure nothing important has been left out, such as her passport, and that the form is signed, and that the papers she says she is submitting are all present. But that is nothing to worry about. In fact it is helpful, but they won't go further than that. They are not officials and your wife will be the customer. If she is ever called for any type of interview, it will be at the nearest British diplomatic post(Embassy or Consulate) and it will be with a British official. That is highly unlikely for your circumstances.

    As far as what you put in the form is concerned, the answer to the question about where you are is simple too. If you think that there is ANY possibility that you will be back in the UK before her arrival, her answer will be 'Yes' to the question as to whether you are in the UK. If on the other hand the Family Permit is processed very quickly and you are still in Libya, it will make no difference. If she is contacted by the Embassy, you simply tell them you haven't gone back yet. Believe me, it won't matter. Remember, the opposite to you being already in the UK, is that you would be still in Libya and travelling with your wife if possible. Nothing unusual. The Embassy knows that you can't predict when they will issue the permit, so can't arrange flight for your wife. The Embassy is required to give priority to EEA applications over others, so your wife's application should be handled quickly.

    I don't know if you are aware, but at the end of the online application is the instruction for applying for the appointment. You will be able to see what is available and pick your own date. However, there is usually another option, and that is regardless of what date/time you book, to go to the application centre as soon after marriage as possible, and be there BEFORE opening time, waiting for it to open. You won't be the only one. You can tell the first person you meet that you have an EEA application that should have priority. If They should tell you that they will try to fit you in as soon as possible. If they don't, you should ask for the duty manager, tell him/her the same thing, that EEA applications are priority. You should get it. I did that in China, and it was the Embassy that told me to, by email.

    As I said. Don't worry. When your wife has that Permit in her passport, you may kick yourself after finding how easy it was to get it.
     
  3. s_l_h_3

    s_l_h_3 Active Member

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    Hi again,

    I have one more question if you dont mind.

    In the application form the question "Do you intend to live with the EEA national permanently?" worries me as the answer is Yes obviously, but not in the UK. She is coming now, but we are all moving back to Libya when I finish my studies. She is actually getting back for her exams, and might not return to the UK as I am in my final year, and her exams take months to finish. What I am thinking is that she should put NO for the reason that she is actually getting back for her exams and not staying permanently and then I might catch up with her instead of her coming back here. Also, if you look at it from a different angle, the answer would still be yes as the question does not specifies the "where" of that happening. Or does that "where" logically refers to the UK? Any advice?

    Also, is there an official website in which it's stated that EEA family permit application has priority over other kind of applications? I am worried that the Libyans who are responsible for collecting the application are not aware of that, and also the deputy manager. So a print out of that would be good to have as a backup or proof of that.

    Thanks a lot!!
     
  4. joneeboy74

    joneeboy74 Well-Known Member

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    Hi
    'Yes' is the correct answer to the question about living together permanently. The question is just not very cleverly worded in English. It is really asking is it your intention remain married for the foreseeable future. In other words, you are just being asked to confirm you are not intending to be involved in a 'marriage of convenience'. So don't worry about it.
    As for your other question about priority, it is certainly contained in EU law, and also in written instructions to Entry Clearance Officers at all UK(and EU/EEA) diplomatic missions.
    I have read it myself many times. I can't immediately locate it, but I will dig it out by tomorrow, and then I'll post it here. In the meantime, don't worry. There is no evidence of delays with EEU/EEA.
    Right now I'm involved in a rather tricky one myself. My adult step-daughter is applying for Residence Permit as my dependent.
     
  5. s_l_h_3

    s_l_h_3 Active Member

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    Hi,

    That is very helpful. I was really bout to answer "NO"! Thanks!

    Another thing. On the Libyan mariage certificate, it states the nationality of the couple to be married with their ID numbers. Will it be a problem if it says that I am Libyan rather than Spanish? And if it states that I am Libyan, would I need to provide a copy of my Libyan passport/ID along with the spanih one for her visa application?

    Also I want to see what you think about the answer she gave for the "Please enter details of what you plan to do whilst in the UK" question:
    "As we have recently got married, the first month, Augus 2014, my husband and I will be travelling across the UK. We are planning to have a road trip to different parts of the UK. From there on, we will stay in York, as my husband studies there, and enjoy occasional weekend breaks within the UK. Basically, the purpose of my travel is to be and have some quality time with my husband before my exams."

    Also, she answered YES refering to me to the question saying "Do you have any friends or family in the UK?" That could also be a NO since the whole application is about her joyning me here and she has already put my details in previous sections. Regarding her asking for the Family Permit not to start until the exact date of the flight she booked, wouldnt that be strange after saying that she is only staying for 4 months? Wouldnt they think that if she is staying for only 4 months, why does she needs the FP to start on the traveling date?

    Last thing, I have written a support letter and I would be so happy if you could have a look at it before I send it off. Let me know.

    Thank you and best of luck in your application!
     
  6. sanji

    sanji Member

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  7. joneeboy74

    joneeboy74 Well-Known Member

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    Sorry, I missed points on your last post. the part about your

    First, let me say of course I will have a look at your support letter if you want me to.
    Now, going back to your above post.
    Regarding the "Please enter details of what you plan to do whilst in the UK" question, just amend it a bit:
    " As we will have just been married in August 2014, my husband and I will first be doing some touring around the UK. After that, we will stay in York, where my husband lives while studying there. While there we hope to enjoy occasional weekend breaks visiting other places of interest within the UK. Basically, the purpose of my travel is to enjoy some quality time with my husband before I return to Libya to take my examinations."
    Next. About friends and family. Bearing in mind that she will be married at the time of her application, the answer can be 'Yes'. She can state her husband lives there.
    ( The Embassy will understand that, after reading the earlier part of the application).
    Finally, regarding the starting date of the application, you can forget about that on this occasion, if she will not want to return to the UK within 6 months of her first arrival.
    You did not mention how long she will need to be back in Libya for her exams, so if it is a case of going back close to exams date just to take them, and then returning to the UK, then there is an advantage in asking for the FP to start from her planned flight date into the UK. That is what we did, and in the support letter that I wrote, I specifically stated the purpose of asking , was to enable a second trip to the UK, without having to apply again for an FP. The Embassy in China obliged, and started the FP from the exact date of travel. Now she will be coming again on 10th July, even though the FP has an expiry date of 14th of July. , (Even if she arrived on the expiry date, entry would still be permitted. In fact, at our border, the immigration officer has discretion to allow entry even if the FP has already expired, or there is not one at all, if the person can prove their entitlement. Its in the immigration rules, but that's another story!).
    I don't think you will have any problem at all. Your wife-to-be's case is quite normal, and UK diplomatic posts are not trying to frustrate genuine applicant.
    Again, good luck!
     
  8. s_l_h_3

    s_l_h_3 Active Member

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    Hi joneeboy74,

    Thanks for your reply. However, it seems that the start of your last reply was cut off. It seems the part in which you advice on the fact that it says that I am Libyan in the marriage certificate. Anyway, here is the support letter I wrote:

    "Dear Sir/Madam,

    I am writing to inform you that I would like to invite my wife Sarah to spend four months with me in the UK. She is from Tripoli, Libya, passport number xxxxxx issued in Tripoli with a validity date till xxth of June xxxx. We keep in touch on a daily basis by phone and/or via internet (Viber) since our encounter and since we have recently got married, on the xxth of August 2015, I would so much like to have her with me in the UK as my wife for few months before her exams in April. She will be living with me in a rented accommodation and I will be meeting all her expenses while she is here including her return ticket to the UK from Tripoli. I also told her to request for her visa starting date to be the same as the planned date of arrival into the UK so as to enable a second trip to the UK without having to apply for an FP again. Please do not hesitate to contact me should you need any further information.

    Looking forward to hearing from you some time soon.

    Yours sincerely,

    Name:
    Address:
    Phone number:
    Email:
    D.O.B:
    Passport number: ABC123456, Spain."

    Hope it is broadly ok. I have used all the suggestions you gave me as you can see. Very helpful!!

    Thanks a lot!!
    Regards,
     
  9. joneeboy74

    joneeboy74 Well-Known Member

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    Looks pretty good to me. One small amendment. Take out the mention of April. Put "approx. 4 months until she needs to return to Libya to take her examinations" instead
     
  10. s_l_h_3

    s_l_h_3 Active Member

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    Hi again,

    Sorry to bother you so much lately, but I am concerned regarding the fact that it will state that I am Libyan in the marriage certificate. As I said, on the Libyan marriage certificate, it states the nationality of the couple to be married with their ID numbers. Will it be a problem if it says that I am Libyan rather than Spanish? And if it states that I am Libyan, would I need to provide a copy of my Libyan passport/ID along with the Spanish one for her visa application?

    That will hopefully be my last question. Thanks a lot!!!!
     
  11. joneeboy74

    joneeboy74 Well-Known Member

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    Don't worry about that.
    I most countries people can marry regardless of their nationality. It does not matter to UK immigration what other nationalities you may have, as long as one of them is NOT British. The UK, like other EEA countries permits dual or even multiple citizenship. She does not need to submit your Libyan passport as it is nothing to do with the basis of her application for a FP.
    However, you will be submitting a letter of support, so if you are still concerned about the marriage certificate, you could include a simple note about it, such as.
    " Would you please note that the submitted marriage certificate records my nationality as Libyan. That is simply because I have dual Italian and Libyan nationality."
     
  12. joneeboy74

    joneeboy74 Well-Known Member

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    One more thing you were worried about is processing time, which you mentioned you had heard can take several weeks. That might be so, concerning a very few complex cases, but yours is not complex. It is simple, and providing she submits the correct documents , photos, fees and application form, you can be confident it will be processed without delay, and she should have her FP within a very few days.
    Again, good luck!
     
  13. s_l_h_3

    s_l_h_3 Active Member

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    Hi joneeboy74,

    Good news, she has got the FP with no problems within 15 days. It took a bit longer as the application is not processed locally in Libya but sent back to the UK. Thanks a lot for your help. Right now she is with me at home in Selby and you are welcome any time you would like to visit :). She will be applying for an unlimited permit to stay in the UK, if it is called that way, some time soon as I have no plans to go back to Spain in the near future. I will definetely be in touch with you if she has any problems with her application if that is ok. Thanks a lot from both of us for your immense help.

    Regards,
     
  14. joneeboy74

    joneeboy74 Well-Known Member

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    Hi again!
    First, congratulations on your marriage. I hope it is long, happy and prosperous. I'm really pleased that everything worked out well in Libya, and that you are now both safe and sound in Selby. My elder sister lives in Bingley, near to Bradford, about 40 miles by road from Selby. Although we are in regular contact, it is some years since I have seen her in person, but that should be rectified in the not too distant future. Maybe at that time we can meet up.
    In the mean time, your wife's next stage is to apply for a 'Residence Card'. This is done on UK Visas & Immigration Form EEA2.You can download the latest version from here:
    https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... _06-14.pdf

    Your wife can apply at any time, but in my opinion, the sooner the better, because she will then have proof of her right to WORK here, which as you will notice, is not mentioned on the Family Permit. In fact, most employers as well as government and local government are not even aware the letters 'F.P.' are for 'Family Permit'. In my opinion it is a deliberate government intention to confuse, especially as the vignette in her passport says 'Visa' which it is not, and has an expiry date, which it should not have.
    Going back to the EEA2, it should be a reasonably easy application, but as under EU rules, a residence card must be issued before the expiry of 6 months from receipt of application, UK Immigration and Visas are doing just that, and issuing within a few days (either side) of 6 months. In fact, a few days ago, the daughter of a friend of mine received hers and it was issued 6 months and 4 days from the date they had acknowledged receipt.
    On receipt of application, they do acknowledge receipt fairly quickly,( EU law says it must be 'without delay') and they issue a formal certificate that can be shown to any interested party, saying that the applicant has made an application under EU law. I did see one recently, but forget the actual wording as there is a whole page of it. What I do remember, is that once again, it does not specifically state anywhere that the applicant has the right to work! Application used to be free, but it is now £55, plus the usual cost of safe carriage each way.
    Make sure that you keep photocopies of every original document you send, because you won't be seeing any of them again for 6 months. Don't make any overseas travel plans before your wife has her passport with Residence Certificate actually in her hand, and don't ask for passport to be returned early unless it is of vital importance, because it could result in them treating the application as withdrawn.
    Finally, a Residence Certificate is valid for 5 years. Under present rules, after 5 years, application can be made for permanent residence.

    Good luck with your wife's application. It may be quicker, because after so much adverse criticism, it is reported that various changes in progress.

    Regards
     
  15. s_l_h_3

    s_l_h_3 Active Member

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    Hi joneeboy74,

    Thank you very much for your kind wishes and do stop by any time you find yourslef around here. You are welcome any time, sincerely. Thanks also for the link to the EEA2 form and brief explaination. I will surely be in touch soon regarding the EEA2 form as I really want to have it done as soon as possible. Thanks again!

    Best regards,
     
  16. s_l_h_3

    s_l_h_3 Active Member

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    Hi again,

    As I promised, I am back with a couple of questions regarding the EEA2 application form :).

    Number 1: In the form page 13 it says "We must receive evidence of their identity (the EEA national which is me), e.g. passport or identity card". This does not say if it needs to be the original documents or copies. In my case, I will have a problem if it needs to be the original and I won't be able to go further with the application as I am traveling due to work. I am assuming that I can submit a copy of my passport the same way I did eith the FP, or can I?

    Number 2: On the same page section 1.10 it askes for the "Home Office reference" which I have no clue what that is so I guess it is not applicable in my case, or is it?

    Number 3: On page 27 section 8.5 it lists documents I have to provide and among these is "A bank statement or evidence of grant or scholarship or declaration of sufficient funds". I am wondering is only the bank statement will do? If yes, do I need to have a certain level of income or savings?

    Number 4: On the same page they require an "Evidence of comprehensive sickness insurance for your EEA national family member" they elaborate on that a bit on page 34 and say "You must provide either a private comprehensive sickness insurance policy document that covers
    for medical treatment in the majority of circumstances, or a European Health Insurance Card
    (EHIC). The EHIC is only valid when your stay in the UK is on a temporary basis. Therefore if you do provide your EHIC as proof of comprehensive sickness insurance you should also provide a covering letter stating whether it is your intention to stay in the UK on a temporary or permanent basis and your reasons for this". As far sa I understand I MUST have some sort of health insurance so my wife can stay with me. First of all, it does not make much sense to me as this is not a requirement for me to stay here in the first place, so why is it now? Anyway, if I have to have it, I have to have it and there are two ways to do it if I undertand correctly. 1- Private comprehensive sickness insurance which might be the easier way but the least affordable or not affordable at all I haven't checked that yet. 2- Providing a European Health Insurance Card, but then I need to provide a covering letter stating that I am only staying temporarily and my reasons for that. My concern is if I go with the European Health Insurance Card, the application might be rejected based on that as I am only staying temporarily. Or does it depend on what I mean by "temporarily"? As in how long? What would be an acceptable period? In my case, I might go for the European Health Insurance Card only because it is cheaper, or is it not?, but I currently have no plans of leaving the UK any time soon.


    That is pretty much all my concerns regarding my application. Again, thanks a lot in advance for you help.

    Best wishes,

    Rehan
     
  17. s_l_h_3

    s_l_h_3 Active Member

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    Hi,

    I had a look into the private health insurance and here I paste a quote I had today but I am not sure if this kind of cover will do.

    premier
    £28.79 per month
    Partner Free discount
    £15.02 per month *
    Includes Partner Free first year discount *
    Quality cover at an affordable price with no overall policy benefit limit.

    In- and Day-patient (hospital) includes:
    Hospital and surgeons' fees
    NHS hospital cash benefit - £4,500
    Surgical treatment
    Medical (non surgical) treatment
    Diagnostic tests and scans

    Out-patient treatment includes:
    Pre-admission tests
    Post-op consultation and tests
    Physiotherapy & other therapies - £200
    Specialist consultations and tests - £150
    Diagnostic scans
    Out-patient procedures

    Options to ADD:
    cancer cover [+£4.52]
    extra out-patient [+£13.25]
    emergency abroad [+£1.64]
    dental cover [+£11.53]


    Shared Responsibility (SR): £1000
    £28.79 per month
    Partner Free discount
    £15.02 per month *
    Includes Partner Free first year discount *
     
  18. joneeboy74

    joneeboy74 Well-Known Member

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    Just letting you know I've seen your post and am looking into a couple of items. I think I can check the latest instructions to Immigration and Visa officers and further advise. In the meantime, No. 1, My advice is to send a copy of your passport. You will have the opportunity to make a 'supporting statement' and you can write anything you like in there. So, about your passport, you can merely state that a copy is being sent because the original is required for short periods of travel in connection with your studies.

    No. 2. Home Office reference. Forget it! Leave blank. Your wife would only have one as a result of her having previous business in the UK with Immigration and Visas, such as a previous application.

    No. 3. A bank statement SHOULD do, but it would need to show you sufficient funds available to support your wife,(and yourself) if she is applying as your dependent, and you are declaring yourself to be a student. As you have found, the amount is not defined, which means they will use 'discretion'. I seem to remember you mentioning some time ago that you had a monthly stipend of some kind. Sending proof of that would be useful.
    This is one of the items I will get back to you about. However, I'm sure you are aware that the holder of a family permit is entitles to work here, and that the FP expiry date does not take away that right. May be your wife can find a job. Even a part time one.

    4. This is the other item I will check on. Can you tell me from whom you got the quote? It seems a reasonable amount, but the problem is whether the cover is acceptable. My daughter has one which we know very well is acceptable. I will give you some details later. In our experience few policies have sufficient cover.

    I will get back to you.

    Regards

    John
     
  19. s_l_h_3

    s_l_h_3 Active Member

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    Hi John,

    Thanks for your detailed reply. I honestly do not remember where I got that quote from as I have contacted several companies. Yes the problem is as you stated it "whether the cover is acceptable". It will be helpful to know the details of your daughter's cover if you see it is the right way to go. Awating your reply.

    Best regards,

    Rehan
     
  20. joneeboy74

    joneeboy74 Well-Known Member

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    Hi Rehan,

    My daughter's insurance comes from Aviva Health UK Ltd, www.aviva.co.uk/health. It is one of the biggest insurance companies. The policy is called 'Healthier Solutions'. But we dealt with a particular person at a broker, who got us a better deal than what we were offered direct from Aviva, and who knew what he was talking about when I said we needed to meet the requirements of the Border Agency,(now called Immigration and Visas, of course.)
    If I can figure out how to send you a PM - private message, I could give you his full details, and the reference number of our policy, so he can easily turn up what you need, but I'm reluctant to put his personal details in public on here.
    I'll get back to you again soon.
     
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